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Thread: Latest dig at Kennel Club over Cavalier health

  1. #1

    Default Latest dig at Kennel Club over Cavalier health

    Article on KC and Cavaliers - December 2014

    http://www.petsmag.co.uk/blog/dog-ow...arles-spaniels
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  2. #2

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    Accidentally put this in the wrong section, was supposed to be in General Discussion.
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  3. #3

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    I looked at it and thought a little about numbers. Let’s say the average age of a Cavalier is 10, and I think that a rather conservative estimate as the majority of mine and those of people I know have gone way past that. Between 2004 and 2013 there were 94,454 Cavaliers registered with the Kennel Club. Most will be in pet homes, of course, and over half will have been bred by puppy farmers. The petition collected about 1,600 signatures. That represents around 1.85% of the guesstimated UK Cavalier population. Does this mean that the other 98+% are healthy???? Or just that their owners didn’t know about the petition???

    It was VERY disturbing to read that a very well known kennels (not named but some research made it evident who they are) sold a dog which at the age of 2 is suffering badly from SM and the breeders have allegedly failed to respond to the owner. I have no idea if the parents of this dog were scanned or tested for anything: the article doesn’t say, and the kennels doesn’t mention any health tests on their web site.

    Jane
    Last edited by Janelise; 12-13-2014 at 09:37 AM.

  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by Janelise View Post

    It was VERY disturbing to read that a very well known kennels (not named but some research made it evident who they are) sold a dog which at the age of 2 is suffering badly from SM and the breeders have allegedly failed to respond to the owner. I have no idea if the parents of this dog were scanned or tested for anything: the article doesn’t say, and the kennels doesn’t mention any health tests on their web site.
    The breeder concerned KNEW NOTHING about any of this until I informed him yesterday Jane. He has NEVER been contacted by this owner regarding any health issues with the puppy he sold to her family, and now he does know, he has already taken this up with her.

    For the record:: Many of this sick 2 year olds relatives are fully health tested.... including her Sire, and up to 3 generations back behind him....
    As ALWAYS, there are very much two sides to this story, and sadly only one side is being reported... the negative side of course... the side that portrays breeders as the lowest of the low.... and some just love to believe the lies.

    Regards,
    Veronica.

  5. #5

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    I said "allegedly failed to respond", but admit it hadn't occured to me that she hadn't actually contacted the breeder to enable them to respond.

    This is what Charlotte Mackaness wrote:

    "11/12/2014 10:25pm
    I was in contact with them on a friendly basis until the CM/SM basis. Of course, I got in touch because naively I thought they would care or be interested. No acknowledgement whatsoever."

    "got in touch" - what does that mean???

    She says other things which may be so untrue as to be libellous.

    Jane

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by Janelise View Post
    She says other things which may be so untrue as to be libellous
    I think when people say they are, quote:: "considering suing a breeder" they ought to remember this cuts both ways..... and if the libelled breeder needed help with the finances to enable them to clear their name, we are big enough in heart, passion, and numbers to raise what might be needed for them to fight a legal battle. One would hope it will never come to this, but if it did, and we all felt the breeder was getting a rough deal, that breeder needs to know they won't be alone.

    Cavalier folk have just proved what they can do by raising just a little under HALF a MILLION dollars in 10 days for 'a good cause'....

    Kind regards,
    Veronica.

  7. #7

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    Well, with the greatest of respect, Veronica, I would far rather donate to save dogs from puppy millers than a breeder from a Court room. I suspect any such action, in any event, would be settled out of Court rather than in it. Libel cases are extremely expensive, and I would have thought that any action brought against a breeder would come under small claims legislation.

    Most of the money that went towards saving the Cavaliers in the 22nd November auction came from the US itself, although I do realise that donations were world wide (and even I managed to toss a few brass buttons in the pot).
    Sheena Stevens

  8. #8

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    Quote Originally Posted by Janelise View Post
    Between 2004 and 2013 there were 94,454 Cavaliers registered with the Kennel Club. Most will be in pet homes, of course, and over half will have been bred by puppy farmers. ...

    Jane
    I think you'll find the the number of cavaliers registered with Kennel Club is a drop in the ocean in comparison to the number of cavaliers living in the UK. I know more unregistered cavaliers than registered ones.


    They're not only coming from puppy farms, but also being imported (many under the guise of rescue), and being breed by pet owners who think it would be cute if Tiddles had a litter - due to peer pressure brain washing.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Madam Grump View Post
    Well, with the greatest of respect, Veronica, I would far rather donate to save dogs from puppy millers than a breeder from a Court room.
    Each to their own Sheena ... Personally I would donate to both causes if the breeder is an innocent victim, and I'm sure many others who are heartily sick of the on going 'breeder bashing' would also consider helping a fellow breeder who was being unfairly demonised by a pet owner. I hope Cavalier breeders never have to take that route, but the threat from pet owners regarding suing their breeder is frequently thrown into the arena, so who knows if or when this threat will need to be challenged head on.

    Veronica.

  10. #10

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    I would be inclined to help a breeder who faced untrue charges.

    It has happened here that people have tried to sue a breeder, and in the dog press there is, from time to time, a column by the equivalent of a barrister explaining what can and can't be subject to a law suit. The law on the sale of dogs is pretty clear cut, so that unless there is an something in the terms of the obligatory contract of sale or the puppy has one of the named problems, the breeder has no legal obligation.

    Contract of sale: if someone sold a puppy and wrote "show prospect" and it turned out wrong; undershot or something;then the breeder would be liable. If the contract says "as a companion animal", then any "show" defect would not be admissable. For anything else the buyer would need to be able to prove that the seller knew of the defect at the time of sale, and as it's an obligation to also provide a veterinary health certificate at the time of sale, that's not likely.

    This was an example here, and also shows that environment can play a big part: it wasn't a Cavalier but a bit bigger and more robust breed: new owners played with the pup too hard and it ruptured a cruciate ligament: they tried to sue the breeder. No legal advisor would take the case.

    Jane

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